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For like 90% of my invoices, which are usually sent monthly to clients for whom I do a lot of work, I bill for multiple ongoing projects on one invoice. But when I go to create an invoice in FreeAgent it only seems to allow me to pick one project and I can't see how to add another. Can someone let me know how to bill for two or more projects on one invoice?
Thanks!
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Two projects on one invoice?
Official
Response
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EMPLOYEE
I’m
confident we'll get there.
Hey there.
I wonder whether our concept of a 'Task' is closer to what you call a 'Project'? Each FreeAgent project can have many tasks (against which you can track time if you like).
We will soon be expanding Tasks to include a time/value budget, which is our next step towards producing Estimates.
Does it help to think of it in this way, or is there something about Projects which you need to use? Budget, Start/stop dates etc? If so, or you really do need client-level invoicing (which makes tracking project budgets somewhat difficult) then we'll need to have a think.
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EMPLOYEE
I’m
confident we'll get there.
Hey there.
I wonder whether our concept of a 'Task' is closer to what you call a 'Project'? Each FreeAgent project can have many tasks (against which you can track time if you like).
We will soon be expanding Tasks to include a time/value budget, which is our next step towards producing Estimates.
Does it help to think of it in this way, or is there something about Projects which you need to use? Budget, Start/stop dates etc? If so, or you really do need client-level invoicing (which makes tracking project budgets somewhat difficult) then we'll need to have a think.Comment -
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Perhaps. I guess then I'd have to make the projects so general as to only really be representative of clients, and then add tasks as "projects"
For example, for one client during one month I completed both an annual report and a newsletter. I just assumed that it would make sense to list those both separately as projects.
But if I look back at the interface, I have to select both a client and then also a project name. I guess I'd have to create only one project for each client, something generic, and then only track tasks from there? I haven't really checked out the tasks but I can look into it.
The only thing though, is it seems to make the projects the exact same thing as the clients. Do you see what I mean? -
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I’m
hoping this will happen
I'm in a similar situation. My clients (whom I often subcontract for) think of a project as "create this blog" or "prepare this presentation", and these are very distinct in both our minds. I'd like a way to keep the current projects (with budgets, tasks, etc, etc) and be able to represent more than one project on an invoice. -
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I’m
hopeful
ooo I was almost sold on this until I found you cant add more than one project to the same invoice. I know my clients would get a bit annoyed with individual invoices.
But yes if you can work on that then I consider having a look again in a few months. -
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There's just an extra step that's all. Here's what you can do:
* Create an invoice for the first project, adding time and expenses as required.
* Edit the invoice details, switching to the second project and again adding time and expenses from that one.
* Rinse and repeat
The invoice will be recorded against the last-selected project's budget (if you use that facility) and invoice history, but it can certainly contain time and expenses from more than one project.
What we could work on is a way of allocating rebilled time and expenses across their parent projects' budgets, but any manually added items will clearly be assigned to the last-selected project before the invoice was sent.
Would that help? -
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I’m
unsure
Nice idea Ed, but seems a little long winded to me when at the moment I just tick box the projects and hit an invoice button, bish - bash - bosh! :)
Rinse and repeat editing here and there just doesn't fit in a sole traders time schedule! :) -
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Can't compete with your existing bish - bash - bosh solution at the moment, then!
But I just created an invoice that included time and expenses from three test account projects and it took me 6 additional clicks and 14 seconds to add in the time and expenses from each of the additional projects.
If your existing solution also generates nice PDFs, accounting data, income tax & VAT calculations and an invoice timeline calendar feed from your invoices then those extra seconds are indeed wasted ;->
Of course we can do better, and I want to reduce those 6 additional clicks to just one... -
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I too need to invoice several projects in the one invoice. Each project has it's own set of tasks and additional invoice items but instead of printing out 10 invoices I'd just want one.
Other than copying out all the info from freeagent and into an indesign invoice template I've got, I don't see how I can do this within FA. You say:
* Create an invoice for the first project, adding time and expenses as required.
* Edit the invoice details, switching to the second project and again adding time and expenses from that one.
* Rinse and repeat
But how do you "switch" to a subsequent project and then add all the tasks assigned to that project? -
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Tony,
Re-select the 'Edit' button once you've created the invoice (adding the first project's unbilled items while you were at it).
Change the project on the 'Edit Invoice' screen and choose your 'Add Unbilled Time and Expenses options, which will now relate to the project you just switched to.
The new tasks etc will now appear on the invoice.
Of course you can add additional invoice items at anytime.
Does that make sense?
We're looking hard into 'Client-level' invoicing, in which case it may be that the Unbilled Time and Expenses will relate to all that client's projects, as well as expenses that might be rebilled to a client directly. Still some work to do there...-
Client-level invoicing makes sense and I am surprised that is still not working they way described today.
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I’m
confused
Hmm...
I'm not very happy with the way multiple projects need to be added to one invoice.
Bothisbetter describes pretty much my feeling: "I guess I'd have to create only one project for each client, something generic, and then only track tasks from there? The only thing though, is it seems to make the projects the exact same thing as the clients. Do you see what I mean?"
I've tried the suggested "solution" and it works. However, it's not very clear how it can be achieved.
Tony Cook gives a good description of my confusion doing it the first time: "But how do you "switch" to a subsequent project and then add all the tasks assigned to that project?"
Once done, the invoice is still identified by "Contact and project". That is: one project. In my case, the last added project (if I'm right). Not any indication that there are multiple/other projects billed at the same invoice.
All in all, it's not that straightforward as I'd love to see. -
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I’m
hopeing thing will improve
That's correct. The invoice is classified as belonging to the last project that was added.
ie if you have three projects: ProjectA total £10, ProjectB total £10, & ProjectC total £10. You then add all three to one invoice sequentially. You will then have the projects listed for "Already Invoiced" as this: ProjectA total £0, ProjectB total £0, & ProjectC total £30.
This is inaccurate as they have all been invoices but just on a combined invoice, but it only looks as Project C has been invoice but not for the correct sum. This makes referencing past invoices complicated.
I think that this all stems from the way 'Projects' and 'Tasks' have been defined by FA. To me a project is 'design website', 'design stationary' etc and a task is 'create concepts', 'colour correct photos', 'artwork' etc
Hopefully this will be improved in time... fingers crossed. -
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I’m
unsure
1Wouldn't this solve it...
Lose Project/Contract from the invoice creation page...
And stick it to the ADD item list...
That way projects can be added with Tasks assigned to them and all the projects on the one invoice would be under the same invoice number. Ideally it would be ideal to have the project creation page assign a unique project number to each created project so they show on the invoice itemisation aswell. (note Im added project numbers myself in the project title)
Yes? -
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I’m
thinking that's a good idea
Yes that would work to a degree, although the Project/Contact could be listed several times on some jobs - for example if a project as a print element to it (or other external costs) - if the project total is made up of several components. But even so, you method would seem more logical, as each item listed on the invoice would be tagged with the Project/Contact code so each Project/Contact would be able to track what has been invoiced for it and then the "Already Invoiced" field would be accurate.
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I’m
hoping this can "solve" the issue
Looks indeed more logical to me.
However, if I try to add an invoice item there's no drop down field for "Project/Contract" here :\
I can see Qty, Details, Unit Price and VAT (=BTW in the Netherlands), but no Project/Contract. How do you guys get that field over there? -
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I’m
amused
I just made it up in Photoshop newoceans, it's not like that here either :)
(I was just suggesting thats how it should be) :) -
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I’m
amused too. Lol!
You're a genius! :D
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I’m
unsure
@ Tony, wouldnt the other elements of the same project be listed as Timeslips and tasks though? eg....imagine this is the one invoice...
Inv. No. 232 - CLIENT NAME
Project No.321 - 40 page A4 brochure
(timeslip) Design
(task) Layout of the pages = £1500
(task) Corrections = £200
(timeslip) Photography
(task) 2 day shoot = £500
_____________________________________
Project No.322 - 2 page leaflet
(timeslip) Design
(task) Layout of the pages = £100
Is that what you mean? -
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I’m
?
@ andy, there is no such field as 'timeslip'?
But yes, you're right. But my point was as each invoice item will contain the "Project/Contract", 'details', 'qty' & 'unit price' fields - by using you idea the invoice would be laid out like:
Inv. No. 232 - CLIENT NAME
Project No.321 - 40 page A4 brochure: 15hrs: (task) Layout of the pages = £1500
Project No.321 - 40 page A4 brochure: 2hrs: (task) Corrections = £200
Project No.321 - 40 page A4 brochure: Service: (task) 2 day shoot = £500
Project No.322 - 2 page leaflet: 1hr: (task) Layout of the pages = £100 -
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I’m
hopeful
Ah yes good point, that'll get messy.
The add Timeslip button shows up on the new project page...
I also think these buttons should be swapped around, with invoice on the far right so its more of an natural order...
Create Project
Add Timeslip
Add Task to that Timeslip
Do work and track time
Job Done
Invoice.
:) -
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You still don't have a timeslip field listed on your invoice - this page is just a means of adding time to a given task.
You're right with the button order - it make it more logical. We never add timeslips via this screen, we tend to use the 'time tracking' screen or the stand alone app 'Timepost' which integrate into FA.
Everyone uses FA slightly differently so having mulitiple ways of accesses various elements of FA is a good thing. -
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I’m
hoping it can be improved.
Yer me too, I was just suggesting that when a project is added to a invoice (rather than invoice to project as it is now), you'll get the option to add all the tracked timeslips already linked to that project to it. i.e by the time you come to invoice, the projects are all packaged up in their own little packages of time tracked and if you want to you can still add individual items to it....for those jobs that don't need any time tracking.
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I’m
unsure...
Nice discussion going on here ;)
To make it even more complex: I'm not sure if projects need to be related with invoices. Imagine, there's a huge project split into several invoices...
I'm not sure (just started using FreeAgent with a trial), but the way I look at it is:
- One project can contain many timeslips.
- One timeslip however, can be assigned to only one project.
- One task can be added to many timeslips.
- One timeslip however, can contain only one task. (not sure here)
- One invoice can contain many timeslips.
- One timeslip however, can be added to only one invoice.
The normalization of a relational database would give this result.
Hence, the invoice is not related to projects vice versa, but to timeslips. And when all timeslips of a project are added to an invoice, it's clear that the complete project is being invoiced.
Does this make any sense? -
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I’m
confused and wondering how FA developers look at it...
Hmm, now I see there's a thing called timesheet too. Haven't used this, so don't know how to add this to the scheme...
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@andy
"you'll get the option to add all the tracked timeslips already linked to that project to"
You already can?
@newoceans
One project can contain many timeslips.
One timeslip however, can be assigned to only one project.
One task can be added to many timeslips (for that particular project only)
One timeslip however, can contain only one task.
One invoice can contain many timeslips.
One timeslip however, can be added to only one invoice.
All statements correct
Additionally:
One project can contain many invoices.
But they way it is set up at the moment: One invoice can be linked to only one project. Which is the problem we would like to see changed. -
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I’m
possibly right?!
I feel your confusing newoceans....I was and think I still am a little confused over all this timeslip/tasks malarky.....hehe....I think though for a big project that warrants several invoices, (this is how I would tackle it anyway)....for example say a website had 2 parts of design and build...both needing to be on separate invoices, I'd just create two projects for it....eg.
Job No. 231 Website design - Inv. No.1
Timeslips/tasks enclosed
Job No. 231 Website build - Inv. No.2
Timeslips/tasks enclosed
The job numbers would be the important thing here so you can see that 2 invoices are for the same job (I also name the job folders on my Mac with the same Job number).
Two invoices, same project assigned to same client ...and each with their own Tasks listed.
Timesheet I would say is for mass adding of weekly times....more specific to people on contract/retainers with companys working fixed hours a week. -
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Yer Tony, sorry I meant to say that was the bit to keep in. :)
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I’m
hopeful
@tony
One project can contain many invoices.
I do agree ;)
That's also what the scheme says:
- One project can be billed by many invoices
- One invoice can contain many projects
The relation via timeslip makes this possible, because that's how project and invoice - I think - should be related.
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@ Andy
Yes, I can imagine creating two projects (for what actually is one and the same project) because it makes invoicing easier. However, this can't be the way it's meant to be - I guess ;) -
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I personally don't see how creating multiple projects for the same project would make this simpler - surly it's makes it more complex? You can already have multiple invoice listed under a single project. We part invoice on bigger projects.
We either invoice a job with a fixed price (from a quote - which is another feature which should be added) or it's based on our hourly rate, the Timesheets are used to either give us the total to invoice or to see how close our original quote was (so we can learn from our under quoting mistakes).
I think we all agree that the current method of adding multi projects to one invoice is a little lacking... and figures crossed will be improved in future builds, as I for one have more the 50% of invoices with multiple projects on them.
Hopefully Ed will see this thread and incorporate Andys suggestion of moving the project/contact field into the add task window. -
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I’m
trying to prevent misuderstandings
To prevent misunderstandings (my English terrible, I know;)
I agree that creating multiple projects for the same project is not a good idea. Just wanted to say I can imagine some people prefer to split up a project into multiple projects.
Personally, I don't. -
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I’m
learning!
Don't worry newoceans you're doing fine with the english....I bet mine is worse at times! :)
Ahh I didnt realise you could do multiple invoices for the same project.
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I’m
not misunderstanding you
The Dutch have a better grasp of the english language then some english do!
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I’m
amused
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I’m
hopeful
Wow, what a thread. I'd like multiple projects in one invoice too. Ed's technique does work but again, I don't really like it. I think choosing the project in the 'Add Invoice Item' area makes sense. Allow the user to add their items in the Invoice creation screen by inserting rows much like you do when you add timeslips. -
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I’m
thankful for workaround but that is what it is.
I totally agree with Lee. Not intuitive as it stands. I have to say I love everything else though. I look forward to the update. -
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I’m
amazed
Wow!..this thread is a year old!
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I’m
still hopeful
@andy. And we are still waiting for some sort of simplified combined invoicing within FA, other than the long winded way it has to be done now.
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I’m
miffed
Has this still not been sorted?, its very frustrating -
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I’m
still hopeful
I'm hoping this is actually on their to-do list, fingers crossed.
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I’m
reconsidering things
A major concern this one. I'm a new user and really love the simplicity of FreeAgent but I'm fearful it may also be it's undoing. During my implementation i have come across two potential deal breakers with request threads like this one over three years old. Automatically created incremental project numbers was my other wish. Something I was able to create in a filemaker solution 15 years ago but also strangely lacking in FA. My biggest worry is the development response time. you Would think that over three years a seemingly simple feature such as multiple projects on one invoice would be possible. There must be hundreds of users screaming for this.-
Agreed steve, as a fairly new user im finding these issues too with job numbers, i have to keep a separate book of jobs so i know what the next project number is, there seems to be no urge from FA to continue its development and keep improving. Pull your fingers out FA!
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I’m
dissapointed
1I agree, I'm evaluating FA on a trial too and I invoice each client for several different projects at the end of every month. It's easier for them that way. I really need to be able to send them one combined invoice. Disappointed that there doesn't seem an easy way to do that yet. I've been using Studiometry up to now which when you generate an invoice simply has a checkbox for 'multi-project' invoice, you then simply select the projects you want to include and the invoice is generated. Seems simple enough? Other than that, FA seems good but I'm still undecided as to whether I can switch because of this.
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2This is the first real missing feature I have found. Perhaps 'projects' should really be called 'clients' if never going to fix. Disappointing that this thread is three years old but no solution. FA great otherwise.
Roy -
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I’m
amused
I agree with comment just above. I have a Client, (a consulting firm) where each of their clients I work with are separate projects. Some require a lot of invoice detail and some less. My primary client (the consult firm) wants just one invoice, but with each of thier clients (projects) set out separately in that invoice. no matter what Ed says, FreeAgent does not do that. The 'edit' approach mixes up the work and it aint slick. Shame, as the rest of the system is great. So what I think we need, is a "Primary Client" level, then project levels that can auto flow into a single invoice at 'project level'. I wait with baited breath.
I cant find anything else to grumble about though, and I highly recommend this service overall. -
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I’m
frustrated
Currently trialling FA. Would dearly love to use it, but this not being able to add multiple projects on one invoice thing is a big stumbling block for me.
I do a lot of work on different projects for a lot of clients and I don't want to issue multiple invoices to clients each month and neither do they want me to.
Three years and still no solution to something this simple? What's the plan with this please? -
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I’m
frustrated
I agree this is a big problem with FreeAgent. I, like many other freelancers, often work on multiple projects for a client. I have tried the proposed work-around of editing an invoice, changing the project, adding billable time, then repeating for each project. The problem with this is the total invoice amount get added to the last project associated with the invoice, which affects the project breakdown. There appears to be no way for me to see how much has really been billed for each project. The fact this thread is now three years old and with no acceptable solution, leads me to believe this problem will not be fixed any time soon. I am currently exploring other online accounting systems as this flaw is a cause of great frustration and a real deal-breaker for me. It's a real shame, as everything else about FreeAgent is awesome.
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I’m
frustrated
The thing I've found with all online/cloud based services is that they all lack one important feature that would make them truly useful. I'm persevering with Freeagent during the trial period, basically experimenting to see if it's right for me.
To get around the lack of multiple projects on one invoice I've basically assigned one project to each client and then each project becomes a task. I then enter timeslips against each task (project) as a whole rather than individual tasks of the project. I've been using Toodledo for task management for a while now and although it's not perfect it does the job of tracking what I've been working on anyway so I don't necessarily need my accounts application to also track time at the task level. It would be nice, but I think I'm ok with summarising the time spent on a project for accounting purposes. If the client wants a breakdown (which they never do) I can run off a report from elsewhere.
When it comes to invoicing I simply add all unbilled time and group timeslips by task, which effectively gives me one line for each project. I can also still see how many hours have been billed for each project (in the task list for a project) but it does mean I can only see how much I've billed for each client rather than each project. I haven't come across any other problem with this. Yet.
I guess no application is ever going to be perfect, but this seems like such a big oversight that would prevent many people in our situation from using FA to it's full potential. -
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Frankly speaking, whilst FA is a god-send, 3 years waiting for a pretty popular request is hard to accept.
What is the complication? -
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I’m
frustrated and dissapointed
"We're looking hard into 'Client-level' invoicing" - 3 years to get it working? I've had to work with some less than productive developers in my time, but even they could have got this working quicker than that!
I'm in the same boat as everyone else, clients with multiple projects that I want to track individually but invoice on a single invoice. *Please* sort this out as it's a major flaw in the system.
In the mean time if you insist that we use tasks to identify our projects at least change "Project Profitability" to "Client Profitability". Another shame as this is something that would be quite nice to know at a project level. -
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I’m
frustrated
Quite unbelievable. I can't figure out why I would ever want to keep track of more than one project at a time for a client if I can't actually bill them on this basis.
Surely on the invoice creation page, where you decide whether to include time, expenses or estimates this simply needs to have a "Choose a project" drop down there rather than at the top (and should already be filled in if you came here from any specific project or timesheet screen).
Choose one, fill in the normal options > create invoice. Edit to go back round again and add items from another project. Once the items are added they are linked to the invoice (just as they are now) so they are counted as billed, can't be added to a different invoice, can't be edited etc, just as is the case now. -
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EMPLOYEE
I’m
wishing we could please everyone
Hi there,
I realise there's a lot of strong feelings about this, but it just hasn't been something that we've prioritised, as is probably fairly apparent.
I'll be totally honest and say this isn't on our short term roadmap right now, as there's some other really highly requested features that we're working on.
We won't forget about this, but it's not going to happen soon unfortunately.
Sorry to disappoint everyone. -
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I’m
indifferent
Like sometime in the next decade? how hard can it be to add a drop down option to the invoice so you can add multiple projects?
Also a bit embarrassing for you guys that it took you 4 years to reply to this post, clearly it is in demand, suppose an android app isn't either?- view 3 more comments
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While I realise this would take a chunk of coding, it does not appear to need a major re-structure of how the data is stored or linked. Timesheets and expenses (and estimates if you use them) are already linked to invoices, and locked when that is done so they can't be changed or linked to a different invoice. They are also linked to a project to help measure project profitability. None of this changes. The only thing that does as far as I can see is that each project which has some elements on an invoice would need to include the invoice on it's page for related invoices.
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Ok i understand about the android app, but i run a web design/developemnt agency, so i know how long these things take to do, if you have a developer worth his salt (which i no doubt you all are) then this isn't a task that will take months and months to acheive, especially if they know the structure of free agent like the back of their hand. Would just save a lot of sending separate invoices for small amounts that tend to get lost in clients 'to do' lists
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I’m
indifferent
That's a shame, Roan... I'm sure you will get there one day.
The work around is okay, but not ideal as it means that some of the functionality of FA is unused (in my case), for example the "Invoiced (Net)" column on the projects page is mainly £0 until you get to the project which includes all the projects on "it's" invoice. Plus the "Project Profitability" section under Summary within an actual project is useless. -
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I'd rather have bank feeds, for example, by a very, very long shot.
I invoice _weekly_, 2 projects (my wife and I) for the same client. It's a mild pain in the arse, but not enough to bump more useful stuff.
Like Bank feeds. Hint hint. Or the new API. Or...-
Hint taken!
As you know the new version of our API has just gone into beta.
And progress is going really well with bank feeds too. -
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Yup, sadly I've not had time to play with it... :(
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So, when I have to send three or four invoices to a client at once, that becomes a pain for several reasons:
- more admin for me (only very minor since all the data is already in and I just press the buttons. Arguably one or several is almost identical effort)
- more admin for my client (they are having to do more data entry for every invoice they receive)
- bank reconciliation becomes more painful, since in most cases clients will send me a single payment for their several invoices. Auto-reconciliation simply can't do it (so bank feeds might be nice but I would still have to hand-reconcile all of the transactions). I have to go to each payment and choose the appropriate invoice, and key in how much of the payment to allocate to this (no idea why it can't default to the full amount), then add the the next invoice, etc. -
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@AdamV
Imagine how I feel, we have a handful of clients that we can easy do 20-30 individual projects for in a month that all need to be added to one invoice. These projects all have mulitple tasks within each one so we can't as some people have suggested use the FA term 'tasks' to represent our projects.
I just have two browser windows open, one with the projects list open and one with an blank invoice open and build up the invoice manually.
The manual way of creating one invoice is doable, it just doesn't link the projects to the invoice, which means you look some FA functionality as I mension a few comments above this one. -
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I use 1 project per Order (because clients want to track their orders separately so they usually require separate invoices, even if they are submitted monthly), and then use "Tasks" for individual projects carried out within a single order.
That seems to be the way FA was designed to work, though it may only apply to some of the client base.
WHAT's NEEDED HERE
is an option to do client level invoicing, perhaps as SUMMARY invoices containing the individual projects as sub-"invoices"
and an option to bring up all outstanding timesheets/estimates/expenses, all pre-ticked for inclusion, and then untick the ones you don't want on this invoice (perhaps by project - format determined by project?)
I also need to apply budgets to individual tasks, so I can track what is going on. And the ability to cost my time even though I get a salary, to cross-reference the profitability of each task taking into account the amount of unbilled time spent -
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To add in my 2p:
We have the situation where I've been working on 3-4 different projects for the same client. The client pays the routine expenses and then passes on the hours and any specific expenses to their own clients.
So what I want to be able to do is have Project1, Project2, and "General Expenses" as projects associated with the client, book my time and expenses to a project as appropriate and then bill the client for the whole lot.
I can't use tasks because expenses can't be associated to tasks so I can't differentiate between those to be passed on and those not.
We'll try the changing the project half-way through method, but it'll screw up the reporting :-(
It seems like it ought to be a standard feature that you can include multiple projects on the same invoice if you want to. -
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I would prefer to be able to pick how I bill - sometimes a single project per invoice for some clients and for others all projects in a single invoice.
My clients don't appreciate having to process a large number of separate invoices - all of them for small amounts. -
